Talk: Weapons by prefix (Borderlands)

Shotguns

SPR Prefix

It seems that the SPR prefix is just for the look of the gun. There is one entry in Borderlands\WillowGame\Localization\INT.gd_weap_combat_shotgun.INT for SPR :

[Body.body2 WeaponPartDefinition] PartName="SPR"

Maybe the number after SPR denotes the different weapon parts. In that case, the same is probably also true for other prefixes like GGNXXX for sniper rifles or TDXXX for SMGs. --Buckermann 13:29, November 2, 2009 (UTC)

I disagree to some degree to that; there are some weapons that have similar stats when they have for example GGN10 at the beginning. Some just have small adjustments, such as the damage, but there's not much more than that. I don't think that goes for all weapons, but so far I've seen that two guns have the same stats (except damage) when they have the same model. --Gourra (talk) 13:39, November 2, 2009 (UTC)

Seperating the Info

It seems three different things are inserted into this Weapon by prefix article, weapon series, weapon prefix, and model numbers, is it possible we could seperate these on different pages, or at least seperate them through H3s, so we have all this information more organized. Also, could we put a link on the weapon page to this, as some might want to know this kind of info, and as far as I could tell, there weren't any links to this page except in the forum. Or like I started to, but was reverted, put these on their respective weapon pages, and cut the category listing of all known guns onto another page, that way we have one page dedicated to info about the weapon (that is linked from the weapons page), and then a link on that page to known weapons of that class. I find the meanings behind the numbers and names a lot more meaningful than a few of the many possible weapons, with unique weapons (boss drops) being the exception. Majora Kalasa 11:02, November 3, 2009 (UTC)

Well, it's hard to say how a weapon is, as the three things you mentioned affects how the weapon works. There's some prefixes that are always on just one weapon, so they could just stay there, and the general ones at the bottom. A manufacturer heading could be added that says how the model affects how the weapon works.

I think it's a good idea to only add the weapons who are special, such as Sledge's Shotgun and Patton, and let the other weapons that are generated get deleted. Sadly, that's the only way this will work, with even weapons of the same manufacturer and name having the same stats, the only difference being their quality. That's what I'm striving for with the Weapons by prefix article.

I could add it to the MediaWiki:Sitenotice that people shouldn't add any more weapons that are randomly generated, and only the named and unique ones. But I'll have to hear from the rest of the community before I do something like that. --Gourra (talk) 11:17, November 3, 2009 (UTC)

For what it's worth, I personally agree with that. -- Foxpound 11:39, November 3, 2009 (UTC)

Well I know they all affect what stats a weapon has, but they are all different things, much like Foxpound hits on the nomenclature, there are parts to a name that are all different, and I think they need to be separated on this list, as it makes it look a lot nicer, though it may be harder to find out what each part of the name does as far as the weapon goes, it is still a lot nicer looking, and far better for those who are actually interested in these kinds of things. Like how in the shotgun category, we have Angry (suffix 1), Scattergun (suffix 2), and SPR10 (model number) which one weapon could have all 3 of these, meaning we should separate them by these kind of categories, I can start this, just I don't want to see it reverted because someone disagrees with that kind of separation, the movement to weapon pages discussion can come at a later date, though I still think it should be done.

The only thing that bothers me though, is the model number, just because these would take the most time trying to get, as I have a feeling there a more of these than any of the suffixes.--Majora Kalasa 20:40, November 3, 2009 (UTC)

I'm all for doing that; for example there would be several headings like "Manufacturers", "Models", "1st suffix" and 2nd suffix", with maybe the odd heading like "Other" where there would be these C etc. --Gourra (talk) 22:51, November 3, 2009 (UTC)

One thing I have noticed though when doing some studying of weapons in vendors (due to the high amount of white rarities), is that the model number doesn't have any effect on the weapon stats, but it does have an effect on the visuals, I've found two RV11 Revolver (that was the whole name) one had a scope and +50% Reload Speed (Tediore) and the other just had -8% Recoil Reduction (Dahl), but I do know they looked similar, leading me to believe, that model number only has an effect on the basic appearance of the weapon.--Majora Kalasa 23:05, November 3, 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, the model number definitely doesn't have to do with anything else than looks. I found two Eridian cannons with the exact same stats and level requirement, the only difference being that one was 10100 and the other 10110, which made them look different. --Gourra (talk) 23:24, November 3, 2009 (UTC)

Actually, the "look" of a weapon does affect some stats like reload speed accuracy and clip size, but there are too many model numbers to list here. --Saphireking65 00:08, November 4, 2009 (UTC)

I don't see why though it should be kept on three different articles, while it could be all kept in one and the same article, making it easy to browse? Maybe I've missed something. --Gourra (talk) 23:52, November 3, 2009 (UTC)

Sorry about that, I put it back all on one page, the list was just kinda long when I put it all on one page, and will only get long as we add to it, because I know some of the names are missing from the list.

As for appearance, yes longer barrels do add up to stat differences, but Im guessing their is a base model setup in the game, and once the stats are generated for the weapon, the engine modifies certain parts of the gun to match with the increase or decrease in stats of the base gun. In other words, modelers created a gun, and setup certain areas that could modified to make it look more powerful, but the engine adjusts how much it is modified based on the end stats of the gun.--Majora Kalasa 00:17, November 4, 2009 (UTC)

Weapons Nomenclature

I've tried to gather a lot of information on the weapons recently, especially in the early game, as it's a good place to see a lot of "base" gear. What occured to me is that the manufacturer's name should be considered the prefix (it gives some basic bonuses), then the model name is just that, a name (think dagger, long sword, mace, etc.), and then the suffixes combination, giving the meat of the modifiers.

For example, the RF4 listed on the page is just the model name. Then you have the S&S or Tediore RF4: the first comes with +Magazine Size and +Damage, the second with +Reload Speed. I've seen both in two versions (4 guns total then), and they seem to randomly get a Weapon Zoom, so this seems unrelated to any prefix or suffix. The two S&S also have the Nasty suffix, which could be responsible for the +Damage. To be sure, one could search for a simple "S&S RF4 Repeater" (if that exists). To sum up:

Weapon Name = <Manufacturer> [<Manufacturer Tier>] <Model> <Suffix_1> <Suffix_2>

Now there are indeed those strange "C" or "B" really simple suffix. They could be manufacturer specific, and indicate a slightly improved version of the base weapon (i.e. start with 10-12 base damage instead of 7-9). That's only an assumption though.

Also note that I've seen (at least once) a weapon with a faster reload speed that wasn't listed on its card. I think it was a Rolling Sniper Rifle, and I could reload it in half the normal time without any mention of it on the card. Could be a bug, indeed, could also indicate a hidden property (the modifiers area on a card is only 4 lines long).

I also agree with Majora Kalasa, all this information can give a lot more meaning to the weapons one can find and we should organize the page as such (and maybe rename it to "Weapon Classification", or something along those lines). -- Foxpound 11:39, November 3, 2009 (UTC)

Why was Suffix_1 and Suffix_2 settled on instead of simply Prefix and Suffix? I know it seems odd to call it Prefix if things come before it, but the final word for the gun name tends to be the "type" of gun, and the second to final word tends to be a prefix title for said "type" of gun. Like, a "Thumper" is the "type" of SMG, and a prefix of "Double" indicates a variant of the basic Thumper SMG type. -- Eno Khaon 12:39, November 4, 2009 (PST)

I thought the same thing at first, but the two suffixes at the end, and the prefix all affect stats (as well as manufacturer tier to a degree) where as the model number, does not, making it seem like the root, and not suffix 2. For instance, an RV11 Bloody Revolver, and an RV11 Swift Viper, would look quite a bit alike if you discount the color, despite being 2 different types of revolvers, where as if you compare a RV11 Bloody Revolver to a RV30 Bloody Revolver, there would be quite a difference visually (barrel lengths might even be different despite having the same damage output and such like that). Regardless, maybe it can go either way, but this seemed to make more sense after awhile.--Majora Kalasa 21:04, November 4, 2009 (UTC)

Ah, that does make sense. I guess what it boils down to then is if how the gun looks is what matters or how it behaves (while two Thumpers might look very different, they tend to perform similarly). Rather, that would determine which base part of the gun weapon info would focus on (its model number and so appearance, versus its final suffix and so its general firing characteristics); I mean, I could be off base, and weapon model might have larger performance similarity than the final suffix... Regardless, I still personally feel Prefix and Suffix and more worthwhile terms than two numbered Suffixes, but I'm not going to change the entry just because of my personal preference. -- Eno Khaon 13:17, November 4, 2009 (PST)

Looks like there is a part we missed, noticed then when looking at the standard revolvers in the vender, some had no suffix 1 nor the right manufacturer to change their fire rates, yet somehow they were different, RV series had 1.3 Fire Rates, yet the DL series had 1.0 Fire Rates. This leads me to believe that Model is actually two seperate parts, [Model][Model Number], Model actually affecting the stats, while model number is actually the model, for example, a DL1 and an RV1 are actually going to look similar, but have slightly different stats. So start collecting letters.--Majora Kalasa 23:06, November 4, 2009 (UTC)

It may be even worse than you think. You missed material grades. Adding the info on that now. Eno Khaon 23:55, November 4, 2009 (UTC)