Talk:Weapons

As far as damage types go, I don't think Incendiary and Explosive are synonymous. The Incendiary damage icon is like a little red fireball, while the explosive icon is more like a little yellow...well, explosion. If I'm totally wrong, correct me, but I'm pretty sure that's the case.

"Yellow Explosion"--see Dahl ZX10 Urban "Red Fireball"--see Vladof the Clipper

Red text effect discussion
I redid the organization for all the flavor text using the game's localization information. I found some text that may never occur on a weapon, and there was some text listed on this page that I did not find (left as a comment in the wiki markup for posterity.) However, there is some question as to what some of the flavor text does. Please use this page here as a place to discuss effects before changing them on the front-facing page. Anpheus 23:19, October 31, 2009 (UTC)

Give Sick
I noticed someone changed the effect of Give Sick to chance to daze or stun enemies. This does not seem to be the case with the Give Sick weapons I've seen, or what other players have reported. I reverted that specific change until there's some clarification. I know for a fact that I've never seen Give Sick daze an enemy, so perhaps it is a passive skill the player has which is causing the daze. Anpheus 23:19, October 31, 2009 (UTC)

This might be a play on the phrase "taken ill" or "taken sick". --Lagged 04:08, November 7, 2009 (UTC)

Weapon Classifications
All the weapon classes have certain names attached to them, and rather than listing all the various possible guns (keep uniques though), could these be listed instead, like Revolvers for example, they come along with names such as Law (not sure, higher damage?), Viper/Anaconda (Corrosive), Equalizer (Ammo Regen), or just plain ol Revolver. Or like Double Anarchy SMGs which always fire 4 shots with one trigger pull.--69.179.247.235 04:43, October 30, 2009 (UTC)

That's already the plan, believe it or not. Most active contributors seem to have given up hope trying to create an article for every possible weapon on Pandora. And rightly so, given the fact that attempting to build over 17,500.000 weapons pages within the next decade would be an almost certainly futile effort. Check out the Forum Pages for more information/discussion on this topic. --Aelwrath45 06:30, October 30, 2009 (UTC)

I think it would be worth noting what effect each of the names have though. Effectively the names and red texts are just like prefixes and suffixes in Diablo and Diablo 2. The maker + gun model gives a base weapon, add the pre/suf-fixes and you have modifiers, which gives you the final weapon.

For example: DAHL - Less Recoil CR28 - Model Number Urban - Less Recoil Raven - Short Zoom (looks like 1.4x zoom specifically)

It is just a matter of finding out as many of the names as possible and noting what the guns do, not to mention where to put it. Do we want to make a whole new page for it, or just add it to the weapons page near the red text part. Stoan 13:25, October 30, 2009 (UTC)

In a few hours, when I have some time to sit down and do this, I'm going to change all the of the Category pages for the weapons to something like, "Specific Weapons Discovered" so that it does not imply that weapons found with a name congruent to those on the page will have the same attributes. I will have to write pages beforehand that describe the known base attributes of specific models of weapon, so that they can replace the current Category pages. The current Category pages will be very helpful data sets that we can use to compile the list of known weapon models. --Mattknox 16:31, November 3, 2009 (UTC)

Customization
No customization? :( I want to have the ability to change color, and honestly that's all. Nothing like pink assault rifles. I'd like to color it in faded, bland camouflage. LJ Carrion 04:55, October 1, 2009 (UTC)


 * I'd like to make some modifications, too. I've got some favorite styles, and wouldn't mind throwing a scope on one or two guns. Don't sweat your pink assault rifle, though. Nothing scarier than seeing a man with a pink gun, because you know that every time someone started crap over it, he's the one who walked away alive. ;) - LobsterMobster 20:09, October 30, 2009 (UTC)

weapon list
Rather than have a huge list of weapons on this page should we instead just link to the category page in the list section? Otherwise this list will quickly become incorrect. --Slyrat 19:21, October 22, 2009 (UTC)

Why the hell is there a weapon list if there is 17 million guns,morons.I think it should be deleted.Monkeyman2547 00:28, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

I found an orange weapon and a yellow weapon, they are clearly different colours as they are side by side in the backpack. Any idea where yellow would fit in the rarity classification?


 * Ok, so this topic has had more chat than when Britney Spears got fat.... Bad joke, but this is actually making me mad. There are a set amount of "BASE" guns. Like Tediore AC2 or something. The reason there are 17million guns are because there are changes to them, like does fire damage is different from the plain gun, just like does fire damage and has a 5x zoom is different from the others. Now we can classify all the base guns and named guns because they will all have some base stat to them that will get altered with randomization. Please stop debating this.


 * If you all want to make a system that "works" please don't just say the current one should be deleted. We need something that talks about the guns, so our current one works until you can propose something better. - XPhoenix777 13:41, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

Weapon Rarity
Could someone update the weapon rarity section on this page with the correct colors? The correct colors are: White -> Green -> Blue -> Purple -> Yellow -> Orange -> Dark Orange -> Pearlescent(?).

Here is a screenshot to show most of them in order. 

And a picture of one of the Pearlescent(?) weapons. 

Done --Fireman9iner 09:20, October 26, 2009 (UTC)


 * Pearlescent is not a confirmed category so I have added the rarity section to reflect this until further confirmation from Gearbox. Unreal Warfare 13:06, October 31, 2009 (UTC)


 * I too think that pearlescent is a glitch rather than its own category. I found a few, and the price and attributes on them were more in line with the green or blue rarity level. --Buckermann 15:31, October 31, 2009 (UTC)
 * I've removed Pearlesecant as a category until a developer confirms if it is an intended category (which I doubt) or a bug. They're not pearlesecant anyway they are white. Unreal Warfare 15:55, October 31, 2009 (UTC)

Red Weapon Rarity
Someone needs to remove the 'red' rarity from the list, along with the screenshot. It's so blatently photoshopped. Look at the font and the artifacting around the text. Don't get me wrong, I would love it if they were real... but c'mon.

Edit: Ok, some actually did it while I was writing this. nvm. ^^

Pearlescent weapons
Here is evidence supporting that they are more than likely a bug in the system.

Found in multiple places in the game files:

"WeaponPartCost0_Cheap" "WeaponPartCost1_Common" "WeaponPartCost2_Uncommon" "WeaponPartCost3_Uncommoner" "WeaponPartCost4_Rare" "WeaponPartCost5_VeryRare" "WeaponPartCost6_Legendary"

Also:

"Weight_Awesome_0_VeryCommon" "Weight_Awesome_1_Common" "Weight_Awesome_2_Uncommon" "Weight_Awesome_3_Uncommoner" "Weight_Awesome_4_Rare" "Weight_Awesome_5_VeryRare" "Weight_Awesome_6_Legendary"

There are 7 levels of rarity of items in game. Colors are:

-- White -- Green -- Blue -- Purple -- Yellow -- Orange -- Dark Orange

Also a developer has confirrmed previously that Orange are the rarest weapons in the game. I would have thought he would have said Pearlescent if they were included with intent.

Now if you want the wiki to remain 100% accurate, until confirmed otherwise, these should not be listed under the rarity category. I have however made a note about their possible existance. Also Pearl weapons are a community made name and not a name confirmed by developers either. Unreal Warfare 19:40, October 31, 2009 (UTC)


 * I agree (and personally would have called them Ivory!). Though it would be kind of cool if they were intentional, to reward people who check every item regardless of color. :) - LobsterMobster 04:46, November 1, 2009 (UTC)


 * Well, it also helps if you READ what the stats are so you see a flavor text, some Whites in my experience have outclassed a few Oranges. --Catman2030 22:04, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

There is no yellow rarity level
Note: There is a word for light orange... It is yellow.

I have come to the conclusion that there is no yellow rarity level. White-Green-Blue-Purple-Orange is all there is. I just took this picture with my cellphone (no screenshot possible during loading) after searching for ~4 hours for yellow items. And unless the tooltip is wrong (certainly not impossible) there simply is no yellow. Yellow and Orange are the same. --Buckermann 22:51, October 31, 2009 (UTC)

Ps: Since I'm not infallible, I have not started moving all the Yellow/Dark Orange weapons to Orange. If you do not agree with my above conclusion, please say so. --Buckermann 23:05, October 31, 2009 (UTC)

It seems I was wrong. Just after I posted the above text, I found a weapon with a different kind of orange. Now I'm completly confused. It seems like there are two kinds of orange. So the loading tip was right and wrong at the same time. I think I take some aspirin... --Buckermann 23:32, October 31, 2009 (UTC)

There are actually 3 different grades of orange as you can see in this screenshot from the GGN Pearl Cyclops page. They are very similar, all different shades of orange. I was under the impression they were being considered yellow, orange, and dark orange for the sake of clarity though the lightest one isn't quite yellow. The colors also do appear even lighter in the weapon info panel than in the inventory list. Nimbulan 01:01, November 1, 2009 (UTC)

I changed the color of rarity using a Fraps Screenshot and Paint.net Color selector tool to get the real color. You can see the 3 different color of Orange. But saying Yellow and not Light orange should be better I think.--Rubyus 03:57, November 1, 2009 (UTC)

Yes, your are right. There are indeed three different shades of orange. And regarding yellow; the colour of the name of a item on a in-game data-card for the lightest orange looks a lot like yellow, while the saved image of a data-card is quite different. In this picture the first line is from the in-game data-card, the second from the saved data-card. Quite a difference, and potentially very confusing if you rely on the in-game colours. --Buckermann 14:56, November 1, 2009 (UTC)

ATTENTION!!! Although there ARE 3 types of orange, every legendary weapon can be any of the three rarities. I personally have weapons of the same type that are different rarities, they are just better the darker the color. So, since every weapon can be any of the rarities, I say we just move all "Orange" weapons to a Legendary Weapons page. Please also note that legendaries will always have flavor text on them, but not the other way around. --Saphireking65 20:51, November 10, 2009 (UTC)

For crying out loud.
HERE [] are the rarity levels as per the game engine. Any gun with a rarity value not within those figures will be generated as white. Strictly speaking, the inventory sorts by rarity, not by text color. There is no pearlescent, just unclassified rarity. I've already updated the rarity section on the article page a few days ago. --Nagamarky 08:40, January 7, 2010 (UTC)

Elemental Modifiers
Does anyone know how the modifiers work exactly? I mean like do the x# give it a certain chance to proc (e.g. x3 is 50% chance to proc)? Or is it some other kind of system they use for it? If anyone knows, I think this information should be added under the Elemental Effects heading in the main article. It can be REALLY important when trying to figure out the dps of a weapon (which I find myself doing a lot).

While I'm on the dps subject, if anyone cares, the best way I've figured out to do so is to multiply the damage by the rate of fire, and then by the number of bullets released by one pull of the trigger - which is given in the damage spec of the weapon. If it fires more than one bullet per shot it alternates between the damage per bullet and the number of bullets fired. Shotguns are the best place to find an example of this. So far I've been leaving the elemental modifier out of the dps because I don't have any idea how to put it into the calculations. I'm also starting to think that it's best to carry around at least one weapon with each type of elemental damage for those ugly situations when you run into more than one badass, so that you can use whatever weakness they may have against them (e.g. in the vault with all the guardians). But now I'm getting into theorycrafting so I'm going to stop there. 164.107.95.36 11:42, October 25, 2009 (UTC)


 * I think it has to do with the damage instead of the chance. I've seen 2x that have a 'Very High Elemental Effect Chance' and 3x with 'High Elemental Effect Chance'124.183.114.83 04:58, October 26, 2009 (UTC)

(OP) Found on a forum that it modifies both proc and damage. They got it from the strategy guide, but didn't say any specific numbers. 164.107.95.22 21:36, October 26, 2009 (UTC)

A quick glance at the topic seems to make people believe that x4 is 100% chance, x3 is 75%, x2 50%, x1 is 25%. I've noticed that all my shots using a x4 weapon with no other elemental "keyword" seem to land elemental damage. Then again, it's an SMG and I always have a skill to boost the proc chance so it's hard to say for sure. It could be that the "High Elemental Effect" keywords increase the regular proc chance without increasing the damage of each proc. I'm tempted to sit in a low-level zone with x1, x2, x3, x4 single shot weapons and see how often they proc, then do a median for each. --QuantumOmega 02:51, November 7, 2009 (UTC)

Elemental modifiers are not straight proc based. Read http://gbxforums.gearboxsoftware.com/showthread.php?t=86431 for more information. In a nutshell: Different weapons handle procs differently. A (non legendary) SMG/Rifle/Shotgun can only proc for x2 (even if they are x1 guns!). The xN modifier tends to affect the tech level of a gun, which increases its tech pool. Every time the gun procs, a certain amount is removed from the tech pool. It is replenished over time. Skills like Spark increase your maximum tech pool and increase the rate of regeneration.--Ocdscale 01:04, December 23, 2009 (UTC)

Red Text
Is it just me, or are the gearbox forums acting up today? I keep getting broken links when I try to visit them.

Anyway... I found a revolver with text saying "It's a helluva thing" and it appears to have a knockback effect. There aren't really any other bonuses it may confer other than the +200% Critical Damage. I didn't see it on this list so I thought I'd point it out.

I'll post a pic when I get to my other computer, hopefully the forums stop being dead and broken.

EDIT: It definitely has a knockback effect. None of my other revolvers do. 75.187.66.45 22:16, October 26, 2009 (UTC)
 * Hey there, this is the above poster. I registered here so yeah. Here's an image showing the revolver.

http://i970.photobucket.com/albums/ae184/Misk_Lite/DL300XXBLOODYUNFORGIVEN-JAKOBS.jpg

I'd also like to say that I'm going to provide a little more organization to that list on the page. Stay tuned. Misk Lite 22:31, October 26, 2009 (UTC)


 * Just to note the "for the mother land entry is wrong as its actually fast reload not 10x grenade damage, also would be nice to have this information confined into a table possibly [Red text][Weapon(s) Seen on][Effect] and a note to which effects are speculated VS known maybe as another colloum [Confirmed] Lord Simpson 18:03, October 28, 2009 (UTC)


 * Confirming that "for the motherland" is actually fast reload and not shield ignoring. Really fast reload.


 * I provided said little more organization by looking through the game data files (specifically the localization iformation in Borderlands\WillowGame\Localization\INT\) and pulling out all the flavor text and descriptions that people consider relevant.173.25.36.88 18:15, October 31, 2009 (UTC)

I think it should be noted...
that any red text appearing on "unique" weapons (boss drops, quest rewards, etc.) should be pointed out. For example, "A Watchful Eye" appears only on "The Sentinel" and will not appear on any other gun. Misk Lite 04:40, October 27, 2009 (UTC)


 * Yes, although some red text will appear on a variety of guns. And speaking of that, does anyone know what "It's a painful thing." does for "The Blister" shotgun? (Quest reward for killing Mothrakk) 67.193.109.219 22:25, October 27, 2009 (UTC)


 * I think we should consider making a special page just for the weapon Special Effects (red lettered text), because after a while the Weapons page is going to get really cluttered.


 * I Second this maybe a little blurb about the red text with an example then a link to the dedicated article--Lord Simpson 19:43, October 29, 2009 (UTC)


 * I agree that special notes about the red text would be helpful where appropriate, but I don't know if the main page is the place to do it. I've noticed that some of the text now has its reference explained parenthetically; since virtually all red text alludes to something, this could get very messy very quickly. -LobsterMobster 20:06, October 30, 2009 (UTC)


 * I think the flavor text definitely needs to have its own page for all of them. Having sections of that page for each weapon type (like it is now) is also good. We should also not have a page for each text string, and then another for the unique weapon. Just the weapon should be fine, and we can put a section for the red text on the page for the weapon. The reference could be on the Flavor Text page, or on the unique weapon's page in the flavor text section. -Zaybertamer 17:12, November 2, 2009 (UTC)


 * Flavor Text should have it's own page, but not EVERY SINGLE EFFECT! Each effect is specific to ONE gun. People dont realize that the guns are the same, just diferent model numbers. For example, I have found 3 Pestilent Defilers, 2 Helfire SMGs 2 Volcano Snipers, and 3 Thanatos pistols. They do have diferent stats and effects, but there are hundreds of possible combos for each weapon, theres no way we can make a page for each one, and therefore we dont need a page for each effect to list only one weapon for each one! --Saphireking65 17:44, November 2, 2009 (UTC)


 * I set it up like this for the links to pages, as you found, with the flavor text entries pointing to overarching classes of weapons, not specific models.


 * Yeah, saphire, I didn't mean for each individual effect, but a page listing all of them, what gun has it, and a brief description of the effect. I like people adding what the reference is, so this is good to have too. So shall we make a page called Flavor Weapon Effects (or something like that), and move that whole section from weapons on it, replacing it with a small paragraph and a link? Oh, nice work with removing the links saphire, it looks MUCH better now =) -Zaybertamer 19:40, November 2, 2009 (UTC)

gearbox weapons
some weapons in the game rather than have the name atlas or s&s have the name gearbox e.g

http://gbxforums.gearboxsoftware.com/showthread.php?t=78314&highlight=basement+sniper

thse are easter egg weapons rider is a sniper found in new haven its a referance to a christmas film where a charecter has a bb gun called rider

--

There is also a starting pack of weapons all made by gearbox that were acessable via dowload code for the xbox 360. (Can anyone confirm if they are in the PS3 or PC version?) They are all level 3 and significantly better than anything else you can get at that point in the game. P35TY 07:17, November 12, 2009 (UTC)

Pew Pew Pew red text change
Pew Pew Pew radically increases crit damage. My Mercurial Blaster's regular hits are 164 and the crits are over 4k damage. 67.193.109.219 18:39, October 29, 2009 (UTC)
 * Feel free to change the text here.--Buckermann 18:46, October 31, 2009 (UTC)

playthrough 1/2 weapons?
unique weapons change in each playthrough according to level. this change should be noted on each unique weapons page.--71.192.239.165 17:11, October 30, 2009 (UTC)

I can't remember if this has come up on the forums or not, but I was thinking the same thing. I'm around halfway done my second playthrough, and am saving any guaranteed drops I can to upload to the wiki. --Aelwrath45 17:18, October 30, 2009 (UTC)

Long and Strong
Long and Strong doesn't give a scope. I believe it may be just bonus damage, as I have a weapon with no scope but still featuring the red text.--Troglodytejb 01:40, November 1, 2009 (UTC)

Probably more damage and maybe better accuracy/recoil.I got a gun with +dmg/-recoil stats and somewhat higher accuracy than most guns I've had, oh and no scope either.


 * Well what I noticed is that it did more damage AND had a higher accuracy, the add-ons only influence what they specifically do, if you see a blade it means + whatever % melee damage, if you see a scope it means x number zoom. The Flavor text is just signifying that it has better accuracy (Long), and does more damage (and Strong) --Catman2030 22:01, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

On Lights and their Necessity
Under the red text effect "Need a Light," someone wrote that it's a possible reference to the Starcraft's Terran Firebat. The phrase, "need a light?" is simply a common way to offer someone something with which to light a cigarette, an act for which the Firebat is absurdly over-qualified. Given the context, there's nothing to suggest the team meant to specifically reference the Firebat instead of the common phrase itself, so I propose we remove the description. - LobsterMobster 04:43, November 1, 2009 (UTC)


 * I agree--Klusark 04:43, November 1, 2009 (UTC)


 * I disagree, Gearbox has shown that they're willing to reference countless obscure film and game references, and dare I say it, the reference made between a weapon that burns people and Starcraft's Terran Firebat is just as tenuous than the reference between "Ahhh... Fresh meat!" and the Diablo unique monster, The Butcher. "Ahhh... Fresh meat!" isn't a cleaver, but it is something a Blizzard Entertainment game character says. If you look at starcraft.wikia.com you see that one of the Firebat's most well known phrases is "Need a light?" Etc, etc. I rest my case. Anpheus 07:59, November 1, 2009 (UTC)


 * Well if you count all the references Gearbox makes to movies, games, books etc. etc. I can't say that they WEREN'T speaking of the firebat, mainly because it's such common gaming knowledge that he says "Need a Light?" so yeah --Catman2030 21:57, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

The Butcher Reference
Someone keeps trying to change it to prefer Warcraft 3 or Diablo 1. Does it matter? They're both Blizzard characters. Warcraft 3's character is a reference to Diablo 1's character. We have no idea whether Gearbox was referring to the WC3 or the D1 character. Furthermore, vandalizing the page by saying childish things like "(also, to whoever is editing this and allcapsing that it's a reference to Warcraft 3, Diablo predates Warcraft 3 by 6 years)" is neither helpful nor conducive to proper Wiki etiquette. Those comments and the discussion for them belong on a talk page and not in the content of the article. Anpheus 19:41, November 1, 2009 (UTC)
 * I gotta say I disagree with the solution that you've come up with. Granted, I'm biased in this argument, as I think anyone referencing The Butcher is almost certainly referencing the character from Diablo. A better solution might be to exclude references from this page entirely, and save them for the pages of the individual effects.  Yamstis  T / C 20:27, November 1, 2009 (UTC)
 * I understand, but invariably Gearbox is referencing one of two Blizzard Entertainment characters. As the Warcraft Wiki Article shows, and the Diablo Wiki Article shows, they both say "Ahhh... Fresh meat!" It's pretty clear Gearbox is referring to the recurring character in Blizzard Entertainment games, and trying to decide which one seems a waste of time. For all intents and purposes, they seem like they're the same character appearing in two different games, regardless of the time span between them. One may be for humorous intent and the other the "original", but who's to say that Gearbox isn't making a third humorous reference to both? Anpheus 20:34, November 1, 2009 (UTC)
 * You make a pretty good point, actually. You've swayed me, but should we change it to state that it's a recurring character in Blizzard games, rather than naming both? Also, I maintain my above position that references would be better placed on the individual effect pages rather than this list.  Yamstis  T / C 20:39, November 1, 2009 (UTC)
 * Ok I'll change it to suggest that it references a quote by Blizzard Entertainment's recurring character, The Butcher, present in the games Diablo and Warcraft III. Anpheus 20:41, November 1, 2009 (UTC)
 * Change committed with proper Wiki references. Anpheus 21:05, November 1, 2009 (UTC)

"Knock Back" Weapon Effects
I do not believe that the Flavor Text gives weapons a knock back effect, I believe that it happens when you deal enough damage in a single shot on your enemy. I have a purple sniper rifle with no red text that can knock enemies back. After damage modifiers it does over 1k damage on a body shot. --Saphireking65 05:12, November 3, 2009 (UTC)


 * I think it might be a hidden property of the weapon - I found a level 20ish Jacobs masher (51x7) that had knock back about 50% of the time. But then I "upgraded" to one (Torgue I think) that did 78x7 and lost the knock-back. My current Jocobs masher does 170x7 and that has no knock-back either.--Alpha1Dash1 19:28, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

Weapon variants
I've been trying to manage the Eridian pages so that we don't have a new page for every random variant of a base type that is found. However, this has led to a bunch of (relatively useless, mostly repeated) infoboxes with the variants' screenshots. Is there some sort of inline template that just shows thumbnails of the different versions people find? With this, a page could have a single base infobox and variant screenshots (if they're really necessary).--Lagged 05:24, November 4, 2009 (UTC)

I ended up making tables with the known variants for each Eridian archetype, which is showing some useful patterns (and an unfortunate lack of important ones). With the number of people uploading their own gun images, and with the lack of variation in gun naming, we are likely to start having images overwritten, albeit unwittingly. Is there a policy for image naming in place? --Lagged 22:02, November 5, 2009 (UTC)

Reverse Engineering?
So, as far as the weapons thing goes, are we trying to reverse engineer the creation system that gearbox has put into place for creating the weapons? As in, are we going to define prefixes, base weapons, suffixes, elemental damage types, and such? If we're going to try that, then it would pay for the weapons page to get bogged down as much as possible with exact names, stats, and maybe pictures, so that we have a good sample of created weapons to start the reverse engineering process. Otherwise, we could just see if gearbox will share all those with the community, but I haven't seen anything like that yet. What direction is this wiki going to go? --SiganQ 02:22, November 8, 2009 (UTC)


 * I'd like to say yes that's the direction being headed in, but it looks like the actual direction will be more chaotic and less well thought out. It'd be really great if one of the Gearbox developers were to help us and talk to us, perhaps we should have the administrators here do some sort of outreach. Diablo 2, for example, has Arreat's Summit which is an awesome resource much like an internal wiki (only, presumably, a few people can edit it, and it predates wikis of course.) Unfortunately, the Gearbox people are not talking openly to us and it probably has to do with a deal they made with Brady Games or whatever for their strategy guide. And outright lifting information from the guide is illegal (copyright infringement.) So... Up a creak without a paddle? I'd like to see game developers be more open but it may be a pipe dream. Are there any more idioms I can use? Maybe some enterprisey speak. We should tell the Gearbox developers that true synergy with their customers and broadening mindshare can only be reached by embracing Web 3.0 technologies in an open marketplace. Anpheus 05:06, November 8, 2009 (UTC)


 * That's the direction I've been heading with the Eridian weapons. I put tables up on the guns I've been watching, and people have been filling them in with their data. It'll get messy until the patterns are completely figured out, though I don't intend to keep the user submitted screenshots once they're no longer useful. It'd be more useful if I could get people to submit debug console info, but I've made decent progress with my own set of Eridians. --Lagged 07:50, November 8, 2009 (UTC)


 * Yeah I imagined it would end up being a mess until we figured out everything. I can understand not putting up pictures of every weapon too, because I believe they will aesthetically look different regardless of names and junk... I think the pictures would be worthless really, just bog things down. Aside from that, I look forward to participating where possible with as accurate information as I can contribute! Hopefully everyone else feels the same way :D--SiganQ 15:01, November 8, 2009 (UTC)


 * Pictures are great because they are better sources than hearsay. Anpheus 16:33, November 8, 2009 (UTC)


 * Wholeheartedly agree. I'm finding out more because of the pictures, at least for the Eridian stuff. Turns out that all Eridian guns use the exact same set of parts, which affects the guns in pretty much the same way. The screenshots are giving me a hint to why certain guns don't fit the pattern, since the parts map to stuff in the debug info. --Lagged 16:56, November 8, 2009 (UTC)


 * Pictures are great, but don't you think that you can get the exact same information out of the name of the weapon as far as categorizing stats and modifiers? That's all I was thinking about. I know you want everyone to prove what they've found is really what they've found and they're not making it up, but... I dunno, that's a lot of pictures, some not very good either. Nowadays, with Photoshop, you can pretty much make a picture look however you want anyway. So if someone wanted to lead us astray, they wouldn't have to work too hard at it, even if they needed to post a picture. So I'm not sure what having pictures posted with the actual guns achieves if it's not just for fact checking.--SiganQ 03:05, November 9, 2009 (UTC)


 * As someone else pointed out, having pictures can lead to unexpected discoveries. For example, perhaps all guns with a particular barrel, which can be identified in the picture, will have the same property. Having a large number of pictures that someone can comb over helps, and having a project whereby we take in and tag pictures by the identifier (prefix, weapon title, suffix, properties), we might find unexpected and interesting things. Having that information and correctly categorizing it is a lot of work, but it could pay off. Anpheus 04:08, November 9, 2009 (UTC)


 * Exactly. One weird thing about the Eridian weapons that few people have realized is that the name is essentially random: you can only get the real stats by looking at the gun parts in the picture or looking in the debug console output. We've started to cut back on the number of pictures on the page once the trends are sorted out. At least for the Eridian Cannons, we're almost at the point where we can dump the submitted shots. --Lagged 04:44, November 9, 2009 (UTC)


 * I understand now, that makes sense. I didn't think about the Eridian weapons... :P --SiganQ 06:28, November 9, 2009 (UTC)

Weapons by prefix
In the Weapon Names section with links to Weapon Prefix and Weapon Title and Weapons 101, I think there should be a link to Weapons by prefix as well. It contains information not in the others. I'd do it myself but vandals ruin everything. Also all these pages need to be rationalized, but that's something else. Raisins 01:10, November 12, 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm pretty sure that Weapon Prefix and Weapon Title were copied into Weapons by prefix. (That's not the best name for a page but that's not the topic at hand.) Weapons 101 is very well written but where did it come from? It doesn't seem like something someone would just up and write - strategy guide maybe? The information should be used but not copied straight from its source.
 * And what do vandals have to do with anything? I might as well not do anything either. --Striator 02:09, November 12, 2009 (UTC)
 * There is a certainly lot of duplication. But in particular the first Model section in Weapons by prefix is not elsewhere.
 * Vandals have to do with the Weapons page getting locked due to vandalism, so I can't edit it. Raisins 02:39, November 12, 2009 (UTC)
 * "This page has been locked so that only registered users can edit it." If you are registered you can edit it, they locked it so if someone vandilizes it they know who did it, instead of some random IP address.--Saphireking65 02:51, November 12, 2009 (UTC)
 * Great, except I am registered and cannot edit Weapons. --Raisins 05:27, November 12, 2009 (UTC)
 * I just did, so maybe it's you.--Saphireking65 05:37, November 12, 2009 (UTC)
 * I am not able to edit either, it might not allow recently registered users either. --Striator 06:04, November 12, 2009 (UTC)
 * By default, a newly registered user has to wait exactly 4 days (345,600 seconds) before being able to edit a page with that protection level, but I just changed it to 1 day (86,400 seconds). I would hate to lose any potential editors due to them not being allowed to make contributions to certain pages after they tried for 3 days straight. I think 24 hours after registration is a more fair wait time. JoePlay ( talk ) 21:14, November 12, 2009 (UTC)

Standardisation
I think we should have a template for the entire weapon page, including a "versions" table, as there is no clear standard for the weapons, and they all look different, with many incomplete. I don't have the time or knowledge to do it myself, but I would suggest it. 86.12.81.146 20:32, November 15, 2009 (UTC)

Weapons and how they are listed
Should perhaps rather then listing a bunch of weapons with similar properties and names have a page for a certain type and then all variations listed there

For example Terrible scatter gun, have a page called that then in it list variations, it could be sorted by either level requirement or some other arbitrary limit such as manufacturer then have the individual guns under that

any ideas?
 * You know how many combinations of prefix and title there could be? There's over 60 for just combat rifles alone. If you put in all the different variations you have bajillions of guns. There's no point in attempting to catalogue weapons that way. -Striator 21:13, November 17, 2009 (UTC)
 * You're right, but listing smaller differences as we are now is even worse. Perhaps we should go with one separate page for each Title only? Basic weapon type (including radical properties like Carnage shotguns or Masher revolvers) are in the Title. --Raisins 00:01, November 18, 2009 (UTC)
 * Using titles will still generate a lot of pages with not a lot of significantly different content. Why do Scattergun shotguns need a separate page from Matador shotguns? They have only one difference between them. I think the best way to organize them would be to divide the Weapons by prefix information amongst the different weapon pages - Shotgun could use more information. -Striator 01:54, November 18, 2009 (UTC)
 * the underlying problem is the sheer volume of weapons, but when it comes down to it the variations are only a percent or 2 different sometimes. That is why i suggested breaking it down in to categories rather then just shotgun, or atleast broken down by level under the gun (so if all i want to look at is say level 45+ weapons its a bit easier ... but again the sheer volume is just daunting
 * listing every possible combination in a tree structure has probably little merit - so the arising question would be, how to structure the weapons listing in the most efficient way, while covering all the possible properties in a generalized way. current navigation is: weapons -> weapon type -> weapon title..
 * how about forking manufacturer first? like weapons -> manufacturer -> weapon type -> model..
 * on the model page, possible prefixes(like Accuracy1_Swatter for the repeater pistol) and accessories (like SandS_Orion_Shock for sniper rifles) and their properties could be listed, together with examples and encountered rarity levels. on the manufacturer page, we could list material (there are three per manufacturer?) and manufacturer-specific prefixes and accessories (like the S&S orion). im not sure how to include weapon parts (body, grip, mag, barrel, sight, stock) though. also, the diversity of prefixes and titles might need a second thought. (the database table used to store weapons in the savegames is rather informative regarding the diversity of the components, which are used to define a weapon) Suelvah 17:45, November 21, 2009 (UTC)
 * Think about who is using the lists and how. Editors for an overview, and users trying to find a gun or sort a gun they have. The thing is, normal titles are made by multiple manufactures.
 * Weapons->Types->Titles includes all weapons with little ambiguity or redundancy.
 * Weapons->Manufacturers->Types->Titles is going to have many duplicate pages.
 * And if we did go with that, when is that going to help you? If you're looking up a gun you'd have to know the brand but not type you were looking for. "I want Vladof, but i'm not sure if it's a shotgun or a revolver." Doesn't come up much. Contrariwise if you know it's a revolver but not what brand, system 2 is actually much worse. Look under Torgue, not there, look under Vladof, they don't even make revolvers, etc.
 * Anyway, look at Revolver. A few normal titles, a few special orange titles, and that's all there is. Sorting by title, every weapon is right there and has it's own page. --Raisins 19:24, November 21, 2009 (UTC)
 * Ok,this actually makes sense to me, at least most parts.. :) // edit: after reading up your other posts, it makes all sense ;)
 * by title, do you mean the complete weapon title, like "EQ11-A Static Equalizer", or "LB Incendiary Wrath"? i feared this would grow rapidly to a massive amount then, hence my proposal of using the model designation.. like the Tediore_Equalizer.. the Revolver page is great.. but unique page for each weapon title apears to me a bit.. "overkill".. - but that maybe my perception.. we will see how it works out.. i am new here and just throwing my thoughts into the arena... :)
 * the Revolver -> Tediore Equalizer example is actually exactly what was in my mind: a general category narrowed down to model designation, with unique examples on the model page.. Suelvah 21:39, November 21, 2009 (UTC)
 * Using the Tidiore Equalizer, you could have a base page called that then inside it you could list variations, There are consistencies to those weapons such as magazine size and fire rate, what changes really from level to level seems to be damage. The game may have massive variety but we could start figuring out the variance in a given level.

Elemental Weakness'
do certain elemental types have strength and weakness' against others, ive found that "Burning" enemies seam to not catch on fire as easily (the burn duration is considerably shorter) Kippeth
 * Enemies with an element are immune or almost immune to that same element. Don't use fire on burning psychos or acid on spiderant corrupters. --Raisins 15:02, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

Ammunition Section added
Hi all. I have been wanting to add some info on 'ammunition' for a while and finally got around to it. I know some of it may seem like common sense. I debated on whether to add it on its own page but decided against it for now as I felt the amount of info at this time is small enough to be a subsection. One reason I would like for it to be its own page eventually (if more info is added) is because the 'Weapon' page is fairly messy and covers a lot of subsections. So if anyone cares to expand, please help out. Thanks, DLanyon 10:39, December 15, 2009 (UTC)

Damage multipliers...
I suppose it's asking the commonly known, but when one has a weapon (let's say with 300 damage) and in the text box, along with crit modifiers etc, it states +50% damage. Does this mean that the damage has already been added (the weapon was 200 damage, but the multiplier made it 300 so the "+50% damage" text in the box is pointless as it were), or this makes the damage higher than what it states (said "300 damage" weapon is actually 450 damage)?

Thanks, --MrCaffeLatte 14:17, December 31, 2009 (UTC)MrCaffeLatte


 * It's already added in. Same for accuracy, fire rate and magazine size. --Raisins 20:03, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

Holy crap it *can* shoot rockets!
I just noticed an odd occurrence, I had recently obtained a Carnage series shotgun and it shot rockets, after one small fight I noticed that it only occasionally shot rockets. The other times I shot it, it produced a typical shotgun spread (I checked the text box, and yes it said Holy crap it shoots Rockets!). Then, for no apparent reason, it started shooting "Shotgun Rockets", I assumed that this was a glitch so I went along with it. Then it returned to the shotgun shells and rocket switch-offs. I'm not so sure it was a glitch as it was intentional, no weapon I've used before (that had the rocket signifier) did such a thing.

Holler back if you know why --Catman2030 21:51, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

$$$ problem
During my last playthrough, I was paying special attention to the $ value of the various weapons I encountered, and noticed that sometimes the overlay you get when you look at a loose weapon list an incorrect (and higher) $ value than when I would check it again in my inventory, this was most common for elemental weapons, and most drastic for more valuable weapons. For instance I found this amazing (for lvl 31) sniper rifle that was worth $153315, but when I saw the overlay before I picked it up, it claimed that it was worth almost $300000. I haven't taken any screenshots yet to prove this but I'm sure it can be easily verified, I think its probably a bug. (Probably using different values for certain properties when computing the $ value for weapons for display in the overlay versus in inventory) 69.54.137.171 07:34, January 7, 2010 (UTC)
 * I can also confirm that I have seen this before, too, and seen other discussions mentioning this on the official forums, etc. 11:46, January 7, 2010 (UTC)

New weapon rarity
I was playing Borderlands the other day and came across a white weapon. Nothing was interesting, except for two things: First, it had red text; second, it was placed higher than orange in my inventory. I've got the zombie DLC, but not underdome. Is this a modded weapon or shall we write a new section into the article?
 * I have already provided the answer to your question further up the page LINK. --Nagamarky 07:05, January 14, 2010 (UTC)

Weapon levels
I was wondering what the highest possible level is for weapons in the game(before secret armory) as well as in secret armory.
 * Level 48 (or level 49 for the Eridian Cannon). With DLC3, everything goes to 61. --Nagamarky 16:36, March 28, 2010 (UTC)

Level cap glitch/Use armory guns
My friend has no expantion packs, and is level 50 (The Max Level). At one point he joined a online game and his level boosted to 61 and he could use secret armory guns. Does anyone know of this happening before or if it could be duplicated?
 * the patch enables the new level cap. most weapons from armory require files in dlc3 content to be equipped.  he should be able to carry/store these until he gets the dlc.  i should also mention that these items should be drop/trade-able.   03:57, March 31, 2010 (UTC)