Forum talk:The whine-asses on the GBX forums..

Original discussion
Glitches are what make games fun. For instance in Borderlands (XBOX 360 of course) there was a glitchy jumping technique you could do involving jumping up a part of a cliff, saving the game, loading the game (I think) and while it was loading you would rapid tap Y and your guy would jump up even further without falling. Rinse and repeat. With that glitch, you were able to get to a Beta Tesla Cannon that had the model of a Rocket Launcher and used Rocket ammo (Source found while typing this: Tesla Cannon (Beta)). I admit I used the Crawmerax glitch at first, and it made things alot easier, but my luck has been letting me down (Me + Playthrough 2.5 + Beating Crawmerax = No pearls. Heck, I've even tried farming Drifters. No luck). Nowadays when I farm Crawmerax, I use my Rose Ironclad shield (Basically makes me invincible), and a Stock Combat Shotgun or Stock Machine Gun. And the only reason I do farm him is to get all the loot (2000 Inventory and 2000 Moxxi Bank spaces helps), open the loot up into WillowTree#, and using GearCalc, adjust the parts to get the best stats from the weapon. Back on topic though, I don't see any reason for these guys to be whining about a glitch that helps you kill some giant friggin' purple lobster. It helps people. AtlasSoldier 14:45, September 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * EDIT: In response to this: Other game engines have this issue too where you can 'enter' into 'solid' objects like buildings, rocks, dams, etc through various tricks. - The area Crawmerax is in has many, MANY rocks in the area that you can literally walk through. When you first take the elevator up to Crawmerax, go to the back of the area (opposite direction of the cliff you can fall off of). Several rocks back there are walk-through-able. Loot even drops inside them (but because the rocks seem to be just graphics, you can still retrieve the loot). Just be careful if you kill Crawmerax when he's right up against the cliff face at the back of the area, as loot can drop and get stuck halfway up the cliff face, and the invisible barrier prevents you from jumping up to get it. Lost alot of good loot that way. AtlasSoldier 14:48, September 8, 2010 (UTC)

"I don't see any reason for these guys to be whining about a glitch that helps you kill some giant friggin' purple lobster. It helps people." It helps people be lazy instead of farming for good weapons like the rest of us. Modders (and I use the term loosely) - regardless of whether you take them online or not - should not even have a say in the difficulty of farming for loot. 14:53, September 8, 2010 (UTC)


 * Well I am a modder/constructor, and as you said, I don't take my moddeds online (though I did before to trade them to several of my friends, one of which recently helped a fellow from this Wiki powerlevel). But I guess that means I don't have a say, right? Wrong. Everyone has a say. Equal rights. AtlasSoldier 15:01, September 8, 2010 (UTC)

Exactly. Then let them whine. They don't need "any reason... to be whining". Opinions are like assholes. They're everywhere, and everyone has one. (By not having a say I mean that they are in the least position to say whether a method is easy or not. But if that doesn't matter, then so be it.)

Out of curiosity, I have questions. If you have a Scorpio shield and stock weapons, then why bother making perfect weapons? If you're going to make perfect weapons, then why farm Craw? 15:08, September 8, 2010 (UTC)


 * Because it's fun. I love tweaking weapons I find and seeing how high I can crank the stats up, while keeping the weapon's "Legit" status. Plus, I have that Mordecai character that I levelled up legitly and don't use mods on. I also plan on making more characters, and once I level them up legit without mods or constructs, then I basically feel free to make constructs for them. As well, the various people I know who play Borderlands don't really know how to use WillowTree, and don't want to, for fear of being banned from XBOX Live, so I do the modding for them in my spare time. AtlasSoldier 15:17, September 8, 2010 (UTC)

If by legitimate you mean "theoretically possible so I'll just take every gun I find and max it since they're all theoretically possible anyway" instead of "it's loot and I didn't touch it and I will continue to gather this loot via proper means until I find what I like", then whatever. 15:22, September 8, 2010 (UTC)


 * By legitimate, I mean "Legitimately dropped ingame". I've found a Jakobs Unforgiven in a pile of loot dropped by Crawmerax after one of my Craw-runs. It's better than the last version on the table on Talk:Jakobs Unforgiven. The last version on that table has 3.7x Zoom, and mine has 4.2x Zoom. All other stats are the same, it's level 60, and it (obviously) has the best scope on it, to give it 4.2x Zoom. I'd add it to the table, but I don't feel like having an edit war break out over questions of it's legitimacy, seeing as I clearly state I'm a modder and constructor on my userpage. But I'll say this; Just because I mod and construct weapons and items, doesn't mean everything I obtain is modded or constructed.. I have alot of legit loot that I obtain through drops. And that Jakobs Unforgiven is proof of that. AtlasSoldier 17:01, September 8, 2010 (UTC)

My view exactly. What differentiates those of us who use WT is how we use, what for, and why. 19:49, September 8, 2010 (UTC)

I might be picking nits here Atlas, but just because it can spawn in-game doesn't mean it did. By legitimate, you actually mean "since you have a near-perfect Unforgiven, it's an all-access pass to building everything else - you already said you'd bump all your loot to the max. Y'know what, I'm gonna go watch Starcraft. 05:28, September 9, 2010 (UTC)

Further discussion
Removed my comments completely. Don't know why half this discussion was hidden by Nagamarky, but whatever. Anywho, a response to this comment: Modders (and I use the term loosely) - regardless of whether you take them online or not - should not even have a say in the difficulty of farming for loot. made by Nagamarky, is below.

You know what you just reminded me of, Naga? The 1950's, back when segregation was in effect. You're making the whole "Modders" and "Players" thing seem like Black and White. You're also missing something I said in one of my (removed, and do not re-add them) comments. I mod. I construct. But I still play LEGITLY on other characters. I have earned every right to give my opinion on the difficulty of farming loot. I only started modding and constructing AFTER I fully 100%'ed the game and got every achievement legitimately. If I was to use your warped and almost racist way of thinking, I would then have to say that anyone who unknowingly received a modded weapon, or has any form of a constructed weapon in their inventory should not have a say either. Luckily, I'm not that warped, and I believe that EVERYONE should have their own say. Keep in mind Naga, you aren't "God" of "Who has a say and who doesn't". Nobody is. That is all. AtlasSoldier 07:02, September 9, 2010 (UTC)

Drawing a parallel between the Borderlands community and 1950s segregation could be seen as offensive; but I do agree with your point AtlasSoldier. Surely each to their own? I don't mod or construct, I don't play with mods or constructs, and I am still awaiting my first Pearl. That's just the way I've chosen to play the game. If other people find modding and constructing add to the fun, then great, let them be. -- Sniperslinger 07:16, September 9, 2010 (UTC)


 * No, really? I never would have guessed that dwelling on segregation could be seen as offensive *eye roll*. Click "Edit this page", and scroll up abit and read Naga's comment (most of this discussion has been hidden by Nagamarky with <!-- and it's closing tag (for some reason). Segregation was the first thing that came to my mind when I read what he said. Separating modders and legit players is like separating blacks and whites. It's just ignorant. AtlasSoldier 07:46, September 9, 2010 (UTC)
 * Hey guess what! I can also make a connection between Naga's comment and women fighting to get the right to vote! I mean come on. What he said was just wrong on so many levels. "We shouldn't allow modders to have a say in this discussion" is the same as saying "We shouldn't allow women to vote". Next time you go to say something like that Naga, think it through and make sure you're not making yourself sound "old fashioned". AtlasSoldier 07:49, September 9, 2010 (UTC)
 * Sigh, I was on your side -- Sniperslinger 07:57, September 9, 2010 (UTC)

@ GT: ConceitedJarrad XBOX360 & : Couldn't agree more... @ MeMadeIt : Not only are Armory and Craw glitched, in Vanilla Borderlands, almost every area where you can have a vehicle has one or more glitches where you can pass through a mountain and drive your way off the map... and they never fixed it... I mean, wow...

@ Sniperslinger: It might be offensive, yes, and someone just pushed a trigger on that "bomb"... plus... apparently some people doesn't know who's who around here, or just want to edit/flame a little before they have their cereal served...

@ AtlasSoldier: Why did you just fuel this discussion?? It wasn't necessary...

Silly disputes are Silly !

I will now take my time to say LOL to whoever posted here. Please keep this in mind... -- 08:10, September 9, 2010 (UTC)

Okay, what the fuchsia, seriously? When did this become a racist discussion? Did you just call me racist for saying that "people who flaunt their stock weapons (people like you) should not weigh in on whether Craw is too easy or not"?

Yes, yes you did. And you said more than that, too.

I put our posts in comments tags because the discussion was ours, and not contributing to the original intent of this thread. You, however, chose to remove them altogether. I'm not going to venture into the territory of potentially covering up for the contradictions you made - and they were large in number - but I'm just going to say that if you're going to misquote me on something, don't delete the entire discussion and (mis)quote me out of context.

Did I say I was? I have every "right", as you put it, to express my "warped" opinion as much as you do.

Opinions like these. This is exactly and only what I was referring to when I say that "I don't see and reason for these guys to be whining about us whining". Why? Because you people don't need help to "kill some giant friggin' purple lobster". You mod for people.

If anyone derives their weapons through modding and constructing, then I don't see why they should be complaining about Craw's difficulty, and more specifically, neither do I see why you should be complaining about us complaining about Craw's difficulty.

ergo, "Oh, I finished the game 100%. So now I'm going to run around Craw's Lair with stock weapons. And whatever I find, I'm gonna mark it up and say it's legit. Naw, those people who whine about the glitch spot should just suck it up."

If this is your method, then yes, you cannot say to people that they should not whine about the glitch. But it seems you have chosen to ignore my attempt at an explanation.

For the record, I'll admit my original post was poorly phrased and needed further clarification. And to that end, I hope this amount of clarification is enough. Look through the original banter between myself and AtlasSoldier, you will see no racial insinuations of the sort. If he wants to draw parallels to 50s discrimination, then it's not my problem. I comment-tagged our entire discussion because it was no longer productive, and the road that I took it down has led to that. I tried to clean up by tagging, but AtlasSoldier over here removed his posts and quoted mine grossly out of context. 09:13, September 9, 2010 (UTC)

@Sniperslinger: "If other people find modding and constructing add to the fun, then great, let them be." I have no intention of preventing people from modding or constructing, so I don't know where you got that from. 09:19, September 9, 2010 (UTC)